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CAROLE RADZIWILL: Carole’s BravoBlog

October 9, 2012  1:11 am   Bravo

                     “I’m just so super smart… that’s why I’m on this show…”

 

Dear Friends,

So after London and Miami, St. Barth’s and Le Cirque, inviting and not inviting and God knows how many toasts, bottles, planes, subways and cars, it all comes down to a couch. Six women, 18 episodes, 12 really expensive shoes, and an elegant little seating arrangement fanned out around Dr. Andy Freud.    NOTE:  Seriously, Carole?  Putting Freud and MissAndy in the same sentence?  Howz about “AndyFraud”?  

I thought the reunion would be more like the presidential debates — a few lies and some posturing, a handshake then back home. But there were surprises on the couch. For one thing, it was freezing. It felt like a vault. The room had the ambiance of the opera after the curtain went down and the Phantom had gone home. We were instructed to wear: 1920s evening meets Truman Capote Black & White Ball. This seemed, on the face of it, a contradiction. The famous ball was in 1966, but six of this, half of that. This is the Housewives where contradiction and frack and friction go hand in hand.

It felt, a bit, like a closing argument in Law and Order. Objection! Overruled! Steely Glare! It was great fun, with echoes of all the best potboilers, and a little bit of Clue. Who took Colonel Mustard and a Pirate into the Ballroom?

Where to begin is the question. Let’s start with LuAnn.

Princesses and people are the same to me. No distinction. I didn’t talk behind LuAnn’s — or anyone’s — back. In fact, I barely talked to Luann  in front of her back. One of the few times I did, it was to discuss my feelings about a situation that involved her and a close friend of mine and we walked away from that conversation just fine. She never brought it up again. She didn’t tell me that her feelings were hurt. How painful it must have been to hold that in for the entire four months of filming?  In fact, I had no idea that LuAnn felt it was “the most hurtful thing anyone had said” to her until right there on the couch. Do you know why? Because she never said this, ever, in front of me.

It’s so silly all this talk about backs. Everyone is so caught up  in backs that no one can see the fronts. What we say in interviews and our blogs is not behind anyone or anything, it’s public. It’s for the whole world to watch or read if they care to. There’s no crying in baseball, and there are no backs in reality TV. It is why it’s such a fun guilty pleasure.

What makes the show more than just watching us lunch and cab around town to parties, are the observations. We watch it, we live it, we share our observations. We are meant to point out the odd, humorous, and curious behaviors of each other in confessional interviews. So we do. When Sonja  said, in an interview, she thinks I’m a poor hostess this isn’t talking behind my back. She’s being asked to comment on a situation, she’s being asked her observations.

Is elegance learned or does it come naturally? Who knows. I think LuAnn is purposely dodging the real issue about my friends and the dress so she can make this a conversation that is focused on her.

I don’t ask designers for dresses. It’s an imposition on a designer, so I don’t ask, because I’m not Meryl Streep — a designer wouldn’t get much attention for going to the trouble. But borrowing happens. I get it. I like to share. I lend my girlfriends clothes and I borrow my girlfriend’s dresses from time to time. In fact, I’m wearing my best friend’s dress on the reunion, I love it! I’m not giving it back.    NOTE:  Here’s what we think of Carole mentioning Meryl Streep:

Here’s the story: I had only met LuAnn twice, I barely knew her when she asked if I could arrange for her to get earrings from Ranjana’s showroom. She got the earrings, enjoyed my friend’s hospitality, then asked to borrow dresses. Naeem did not offer as she says. Naeem is not my “designer friend” he is a friend. He’s one of my closest friends, like family, and I would never want him to be put in an awkward position with a favor request from a stranger because of me. Just as I would no more walk into Jacques office and ask him to send me ten cases of wine — gratis. This — to me — is about politeness. It was never about earrings or designers, or even LuAnn; it was always about code of conduct. My code and LuAnn’s code are different. I’m not saying one is better, but they are obviously different. And they clashed from time to time, as you saw.

“There are known knowns, known unknowns and there are unknown unknowns.” Donald Rumsfeld said that, it’s non-sensically brilliant. I think he may have been a Housewife in another country, another life.   NOTE:  Here’s what we think of Carole’s quoting Donald Rumsfeld:

We aren’t aware of all the scenes that are being filmed while we’re shooting, so there are a lot of unknown unknowns. During the season, each of us only knows the scenes we are in, we don’t see the big picture.

So if I’m not in a scene — like on St. Barth’s, when Aviva insulted Ramona and Sonja — I don’t know how it exactly went down or what was said until I watch the show. I’m watching it cold, just like you. We didn’t get a script of the scenes that were shot or dialogue that was said. It’s reality, and in real life friends meet with each other, have lunch, talk, argue, plan parties, and vacations and not everyone knows what is said to whom, just as in real life we find things out second or third-hand. The filming of the show and the watching of it are two completely different experiences.

Each was a fun wild ride.

We filmed the show last winter and then I watched it, along with all of you, for the first time. It’s interesting to watch. I see the appeal. As anyone who has read my weekly blogs knows, I think most of the drama is humorous and like in real life some take it more seriously than others.

Google must have been a sponsor of this season for all the times they were plugged. There was a lot of googling, including English Common Law. Huh? Ramona still makes me laugh. I was trying to address this, on the couch, the issue of Reid’s comment. It was out of line, there was no question. And rather than give it any attention or weight at all, I ignored it and we moved on. Sometimes silence is the best way to shut down an awkward conversation. I’ve never heard Reid speak like that off or on camera. Aviva knows it was out of character. She apologized and we moved on. We spent most of that dinner talking about Aviva’s organic food. Russ is a vegan  and Aviva’s very knowledgeable about healthy diets. I mostly drank.

Thank you all for your generous spirit and kind words and your funny comments and tweets and suggestions and mostly, for just tuning in. I was completely humbled by your response to the show. I truly appreciate it. I’ve spent much of the past couple years alone, with my words, writing my novel, going mad and now I feel like I have thousands of new friends to talk to every day.

This crazy little ride has been a thrill. I’m a lucky girl. Here’s to you.

PS, tune in next week, where I am still cold and in the same borrowed dress.

 

We’re over you, Carole…

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111 comments on “CAROLE RADZIWILL: Carole’s BravoBlog

  1. I do like Carole, sort of, in that she’s intelligent, which most of the other women are not (across ALL of the franchises). However, I think she needs to be a tad more humble, because, after all, she would not have the fame she does if not for the man she married. Let’s face facts–her book about her late husband would likely never have been on the NYT bestseller’s list if he was a “commoner.” As for Reid, he is a misogynist.

    • I think Carole’s point was that she did not marry her husband for his title or for fame or for prestige. Had she never married a prince, she would probably have continued her career as a journalist and become a success in her own right. Remember, she won 2 emmys on her own, and it had nothing to do with her husband.

      • I did not know this about Carole but find it interesting. I like Carole as she really tries to participate in fun things not the BS, self-promoting grandstanding like all the others. Here is how I like them: Carole, Heather, Ramona, Sonja, LuAnn and then PT. I find Carole’s blogs insightful and delightful and she out of the others (except Heather) I find to be more like ‘real’ people I know! I don’t know any of these other types anylonger, since I am disabled and do not work. Thanks Carole for your fun and insight!

    • I agree, Stacy, the Radziwill name is her “power”. That and the Kennedy connection were certainly helpful in attaining a bestseller status, not to mention all of the A list interviews with Oprah and King, etc

    • I noticed that, too. If she’s become one of “them,” how can she observe them? Of course, none of the NY housewives look like they’ve had work in that overdone way – but now Carole could move in with Russ and be on the OC or BH show…

    • She seems to have an extreme over-bite and I think that to fix it would require some extensive surgery. She has lived with it all her life, why change it if it is not creating a medical emergency and to fix it would not guarantee a positive change in her quality of life. JMO

            • Psh. Yes, things get passed around that way, and even just by kissing. But some people are just more susceptible to herpes viruses. I’ve had cold sores ever since I was in elementary school, well before I was ‘active’ in that way. And I got mono without kissing anybody later on, too. Honestly, I’m glad. Outbreaks get less frequent and severe over time (I haven’t had one in a couple years now knock on wood) and I’d rather have them UPSTAIRS than DOWNSTAIRS if you catch my drift. Lol. >90% of people age 40+ have antibodies to HSV, which means they’ve been exposed. So I’m guessing Carole’s vag is cleared for landing if that was a cold sore. ;)

  2. Always said Carole was a two-faced, back-stabber. She states she would not walk into Jack’s office and ask for free wine but—she did go to Mario to get fee trophies for her ping-pong tourny and then at the event stated that if Ramona said one word she would throw her out. She took Aviva’s side and even told Ramona she should apologize for having sleeze-bag pervert George removed from her event. And she has the gall to say she doesn’t talk behind people’s back. She really is delusional if she thinks people don’t know her snarky remarks are not funny and she really doesn’t mean them funny –they are said in a mean, nasty, malicious way. Nobody believes you anymore Carole.

    • Reminds me of when LuAnn and Lisa on BH make snark remarks and always coyly offer, “I was just being funny…” Wine tasting anyone? And that was just this season.

          • Even if Lisa’s a fox, she has true charm and she’s a beauty she gets away with it. It’s all in the delivery

            • Sorry, ladies. I don’t care for Lisa…people seem to forgive give the British accent, and a pretty wrapping (face) doesn’t lessen the blow. I know she’s loved by many – I’m just not one of them.

              • Im not a lisa fan either. But it may be mostly environmental… I dont actually like any of the ladies on that show. For my money, RHBH takes the snob cake.

              • It’s true. There’s really no one on BH that I actually like (with the possible exception of Brandy – but I always go for the underdog, the one who is “different.”

    • I wonder how funny Carole would think it was if the other cast mates had been slamming her behind her back? Not only does she enable the worst kind of behavior from PT and that piece of perverted trash she calls a father, she is a two faced back stabbing mean person. Carole got off easy this season, she’d probably cry like a baby if it was TP coming at her with one of her insane tirade rage.
      Coward.

      • Skidly, I so agree w/ your observations about Carole here. Carole had a lot of nerve advising Ramona to apologize to George, particularly after hearing him call Ramona “trailer turd.” I can’t imagine how she would have handled being so rudely dressed down by PT at the tea. She says so many snarky things in her blog and in her talking head shots, but lacks the gumption to be direct. I liked her at the beginning, but not any longer.

        • As Sonja pointed out last night, she was surprised by the tone of Carole’s blogs which were written months after the scenes were shot, and didn’t reflect what Sonja THOUGHT Carole felt – through Carole’s behavior. It’s a bit two-faced to present your view one way and then write something completely different. Yes, they can read, so it’s not “behind their backs,” if you want to play it that way. It’s just doubling dealing, as Aviva would say. Doesn’t matter, I’m guessing Carole lost any inkling of trust with everyone on the “other sofa.”

    • Agreed, Tibi, she’s really starting to grate on my nerves, I hated the way she and the others ganged up on Ramona at her book party, then turns around at the reunion and expresses her trauma regarding Aviva’s behavior, please….

  3. I guess carol is what she is supposed to be…. Entertaining. I like her. No I dont. I get her. Shes condescending. She says what Im thinking. She makes too many literary references I dont understand. Shes funny. She thinks shes funny. Shes neutral. She picks sides…usually the wrong one. So I guess Id say I still havnt made up my mind about her. My opinion changes by the second. Heck, someones comment here could change my opinion of her too. Im up for grabs.

  4. I think Mandy was pretty hard on her tonight. Not everyone appreciates her wit. When you write on your blog about someone that you have not said to their face where they can defend themselves, that’s talking behind their backs. No cutesy, witty, pondering thought written in a million similes and allegories can change that.

  5. One thing about Carole I didn’t like was in her book “What Remains”she admitted to kissing another man while her husband was dying. If that upset me (who didn’t know Anthony at all) how must Anthony’s friends and family feel?And if she admitted to a kiss, what did she actually do?

    • Hey @emeraldeil,

      So, now I’m just coming off as a Carole defender, when I really want to just remain a “Carole liker.” Admittedly it’s been a two years since I’ve read that book, but I don’t recall any such passage. I’m not saying that it didn’t happen (did it?), but I don’t think it’s occurred in the book as written at least. If we’re going to cite sources, let’s be as accurate as possible, please. Especially if the accusation is that she’s somehow morally ambiguous and willing to cheat on her dying husband.

      • Chapter 11 (in the Kindle edition) She is in business school and one of the seminars is given by a journalist- she spends the night flirting with him culminating in a kiss on the lips. I liked her too- still do, but that passage didn’t sit well with me.

        • I just read an excerpt from her book and thankfully she did not fill it superfluously with similes and metaphors….either that or her editor did some major revising. It is a much more fluid and pleasant reading experience than her blogs and I look forward to reading it. If you haven’t read it yet: Spoiler Alert: not for ‘what remains’, but anyone who is excited about the movie Anna Karenina or hasnt yet read the book, she gives away a huge moment. As far as the incident with another man, I had read that he was also married and that perhaps more than a kiss had taken place. I hope not.

  6. Carole is the sneaky snarky girl. She’s trying a little too hard to impress with her tortured writing…… Truman Capote she is not.

  7. She does like to go on about herself and her feelings, doesn’t she? I find her a complete bore and a snob.

  8. I read the first two paragraphs….scrolled to see how long her blog was going to be….decided I couldn’t makeit to the end in one sitting….blah, blah, adjectives, blah, metaphors, blahdy-blah-blah, analogies…I’ll just come back when I get bored

  9. Uggggh Carol. She’s too impressed with herself. And her “oh I’m so down to earth, I BUY all my clothes, I’m SO HUMBLE, I’d never borrow- I’m not MERYL STREEP” crap. Borrowing dresses is done by celebrities from the A List right on down to the Z List. LuAnn met a designer she liked in person, took a shot, was turned down, and it could’ve been left at that if Carol (and her fame-hungry friend) had dropped it. Heather pointed out that it is kind of a pain in the ass to lend out dresses, but she failed to mention that it is still done quite often, and not a rude thing to ask.

    I must admit I am predisposed to irrationally disliking Carol. She reminds me of the fifty or so girls in my freshman class at NYU who really REALLY thought they were Carrie Bradshaw.

    • Exactly…heather also said something like there are a hundred different ways to answer the question about lending clothes….it doesnt appear to me that there is any clear cut etiquette, but luann took a shot….and I think I heard sonja say something to the effect that if the designer doesnt want to, he just doesnt send the clothes. I have to agree with sonja…he’s a big boy, he can just say ‘no’. done. no harm done. move on. carole need not be embarassed by luanns request.

    • Spot on about the Lumann Carole debacle regarding designer clothes, Lumann was outta line , she’s a clist celebrity reaching way over her head, she isn’t doing anyone any favors. Puh-leeze

    • I think LuAnn was definitely overreaching her celebrity, but I also think it got overblown. Like I sad, celebs of all statuses ask about borrowing things from time to time- and that’s just doing cold calls. She met the guy, had drinks with him, and took a chance. Not very elegant or cool (and I’m sure her thirst for freebies was a little palpable), but acting like it’s this horrifyingly rude thing that just isn’t done seems like reaching for conflict/storyline, in particular when it comes to Rajana having a sit-down with Carole about it. Had LuAnn put him on the spot in front of the cameras, I’d understand getting this worked up. But with traditionally high end designers making lines for Target, Macy’s, and yes, HSN, I don’t think the “we’re SO above that” was the best defense. Carole could’ve explained that she felt overprotective and didn’t want to seem like a user, and left it at that, but she didn’t, because that wasn’t her only problem with it (as evidenced by the “Ugh, Life and Style is NOT VOGUE” and blogging about how she doesn’t ask to borrow clothes because she’s not Meryl Streep).

  10. i always say, since first episode this season. carole and heather my favs. kind of gansta chic cool
    girls. still feel that way. someone stole my line. i think it was luann.

  11. if you read her book what remains; u would understand. she never says she came from anything.
    actually quite the opposite. but she did not know her husband, when she got thru college, and got a
    great job, working w/many well known news people. going to the middle east, winning emmys. some
    people regardless of their place in life are just truly inquisitive. some people take that as snobby.
    their loss.

  12. I just adore Carol! Of course, I’m weird, because I love Sonja and Ramona, too! I think they are funny. If you make me laugh you have my heart!! In saying that, Aviva is the most non funny person I’ve ever seen and everything about her grates my last nerve. The countess happens to be the 2nd most annoying person on the planet, to me. Heather is slowly growing on me.

    • @lisa…aviva being the most non funny person is the understatement of the year. when she said “take off the jacket….throw it at ramona” , she was so amused by herself. problem is…she was the only one amused and finding herself clever and funny. nothing humorous will ever come from her mouth

  13. Haha! Told ya! I said this since day one, Carole comes off hip and cool but she is truely a little backstabber. I think I mentioned that being nicey nice to peoples face and then ripping on people in your TTC will get you in hot water during the reunion and it did! I’ve said all along that I do not understand Carole or her desire to be a housewife. No one who is a “cool” and bohemian” as she pretends to be would ever get with in a mile of a housewife show!

  14. Wow. There is a lot of hate for Carole. Some of the observations, I guess I can see. Was she snarky at times? Yes. But aren’t all of the women on all of these RH franchises? I guess what some folks have an issue with is that she wasn’t as forthright in person while filming scenes. But let’s give her some benefit of doubt here. This is her first season and her first time exposing her life on camera. It makes sense to be a bit reserved, especially if the seasoned cast members are huge extroverts.

    And really, how often are we in situations where we need to tell someone who is loud and obnoxious that they are being loud and obnoxious… on the spot? That is unless you are a parent disciplining your child in a restaurant (and even then you can tell that the parent is pretty embarrassed to be doing this in public). I mean I appreciate directness, but come on, calling out on people’s idiosyncrasies as they are occurring is a learned skill that one develops after a couple of seasons of living in front of a reality camera crew; not normal interaction between supposed mature adults. And let’s also admit that doing so has never resulted in a calm discussion, but rather inflames the situation and panders to overheated dramatic engagements. The Ramonas, Sonjas and Luanns are constantly on guard for a fight because that’s how they know to grab camera time. The newbies, at least initially, are reluctant to engage because they’re afraid it’ll make them come off like crazy a–holes. This is pretty obvious. Aviva just happened to have fallen into that rabbit hole a lot quicker than Heather and Carole.

    Carole is professionally accomplished and generally amusing in her observations. Something lacking in some of the other NY Housewives. Her blogs are overly written with some literary flair; not to everyone’s liking. That’s cool. But it’s kind of bizarre to be angry at someone who has the ability to write their thoughts clearly with overall proper use of grammar. The other established housewives are thrown, because she’s behaving like an actual person, flaws and all, and not a caricature of a shrieking, emotional woman (which frankly is more egregious and offensive). Both her and Heather have really held themselves up as reasoned and respectful overall. Why punish them for that? I think it makes for a nice dynamic actually.

    • I dont really feel any hate in the comments….it’s just more like theres a dichotomy in caroles personality
      @parkviews comment upthread sums it up best. caroles persona is somewhat confusing

      • I do not dislike Carole but for someone who is as accomplished as she is the cool facade becomes questionable when she signed up for a housewife show. I also think it is silly to go on a shark pit show like that and not even bother to watch the previous seasons to avoid rookie mistakes like her TTC. I don’t get her ,you can’t hold yourself to a higher esteem, reap the obvious bennifits of appearing on a housewife franchise (to plug some product in her case her book) and then try to walk away unscathed. As soon as you agree to do this you are wallowing in the muck. I don’t think it’s fair that she smiled to everyones faces to aviod camera conflict and then made alot of snarky (even funny) comments about the other women and then pretend she is above it all.It makes me feel like she was slumming but it will be worth it when her book releases.

    • I think I feel so strongly about Carole because I liked her so much initially. She disappointed me the most, and I’m willing to guess that I’m not the only one. She was a breathe of fresh air that soon turned to gingivitis. Now it seems she’s just as nasty as the rest of them, the delivery is different, that’s all.

      While I really appreciate that she makes an effort with her blogs, I don’t find them illuminating at all. As I’ve said before, lots of words, but she manages to reveal nothing (I think that’s her goal).

      But for me, the main reason I no longer like Carole is her continued support of Aviva. It’s true that she didn’t see the fight. She decided to side with Aviva. Fine, that’s favoring the person who appears to be the weaker – I get it. But as the episodes aired, and it became pretty clear that Aviva was relentless in her attacks, Carole never once backed down from her position in her blogs.

      Sorry, I think Aviva was 100% in the wrong. And compounded the situation at every turn. Carole’s support of Aviva was nothing less than confounding to me. And disappointing. It was also interesting that she was less than compassionate to Ramona when she told Carole how upsetting the tea was. Then just a few minutes later, showed compassion to George rather than to Ramona at her own event, as George followed her around demanding an apology (even telling Carole he won’t leave until he gets one). Who’s behavior was wrong in that scene? Ramona was clearly upset and Carole just didn’t care.

      • I see your point @Where Doris Eats Her Oats. I would only argue that, while George is clearly a sexually offensive in many ways, he doesn’t strike me as overly mentally or physically dangerous. He seems a bit fragile and probably lonely, saying horribly offensive things to get attention. I thought it was a classy move of Carole to escort George out and let him vent his frustrations. He was angry and a bit humiliated probably. By taking him aside, Carole was actually helping Ramona and her event and reducing what could have become a much uglier scene.

        That said, it was a big mistake for George to touch or grab Ramona. Physical contact by a man on a woman, especially in a heated moment, no matter how benign, is not acceptable. He was in the wrong. Ramona overreacted probably (she has admitted this as much in her own blogs), but he was wrong.

        I think in the reunion, you see Carole and Heather both calling out Aviva on her behavior. They’re just polite about it and not trying to humiliate Aviva in the process. Again, this feels like a relatively elegant way of handling a situation where you need to call out your friend for being in the wrong.

        Lastly, I like Ramona in the way that I like my Crazy Relatives; they are loud, often rude talk over everyone, but generally have a kind heart. In a pinch, they are there for the people they love, but have grand sweeping gestures that have a tendency to strike many the wrong way. I can only take them in doses. Ramona has been drinking a bit too much of her own kool-aid; and while she wants to call it “I tell it, like I see it,” I think most folks would identify that type of behavior as narcissistic and poor-mannered. But again, she’s got a good heart underneath the bravado, I just wish we’d see a bit more if in the show.

        • Hmmm…I watched the show last night and didn’t see Carole call Aviva out on her behavior. I think there was one comment “dark,” and I think it came from Heather. Both Carole and Heather have far worse to say about Ramona and Sonja for behavior that might be thoughtless, but isn’t hateful in my view.

          I must strongly disagree with your assessment of George. It doesn’t matter if he is old or lonely – if a 40-year-old behaved like he did during this season, he’d be slapped, if a 16-year-old behaved like George, he’d be locked in his room for a month. Having been on the receiving end of this kind of behavior, I can tell you that it’s demeaning and disgusting. It’s designed to embarrass and humiliate you and to make you feel less of yourself. It’s not flattering, funny, cute or harmless.

          Honestly, Sonja showed far more discretion with George than I ever would. I would have left. No woman deserves to be treated that way.

          If find it ironic that Carole wanted to save a man from humiliation who clearly had intentions to humiliate the hostess.

          • on the same page with you as far as georg. must agree that sonja was far more restrained in the situation with him than I would ever be.
            I also rewatched his grab and noticed it was in fact harder than I initially thought. There was weird angry force in that grab…I felt it in his demeanor as well. he’s off. I wouldnt want to be in the same room with that ‘darkness’. He’s beyond creepy

            • Yes, beyond creepy. How is it that Carole thinks Ramona should apologize to George? And yet, before the ping-pong charity she told Aviva that if Ramona “started anything,” she’d kick her out. It’s okay to have a preordained “kick-out” of Ramona? Ramona & Mario even provided the trophy’s…but her allegiance is evermore with Aviva.

              Thinking of it, this brings back memories of my childhood. I’m the older child and always was the one who should “know better.” Maybe I’m seeing that here. Aviva is completely out of her mind so Ramona gets a “talking down” from Carole (at her book-birthing party) because she’s the one who should “know better”??? Hmmm…maybe I’m off base.

              • Oh come on now. Based on history alone, it wasn’t far-fetched to believe that Ramona would stir up the drama at her ping pong event. Ramona is far more practiced at this and has a track record for dropping the bomb at a public event and starting the drama. And at that point, Aviva was (and really still is) an unknown commodity. It’s not unrealistic to assume that if someone is going to cause some trouble, it’s Ramona.

                But yes, it was nice of Mario and Ramona to provide the trophies for free. A very generous gesture indeed.

                I think where we really disagree is the level of crime with which we regard Aviva’s behavior. I just think she was an a–hole. But many others seem to want to condemn Aviva on a deeper level. She attacked Ramona repeatedly, said a lot of mean things and generally acted like an entitled brat. Aviva was indeed a very ugly person the last few episodes. But aren’t we watching a Real Housewives show? Isn’t this the drama we can’t stop watching and look for? And of all people, hasn’t Ramona been guilty of this same behavior (see Season 1 and 2 where Ramona basically attempts to destroy Alex and Simon). What am I missing here?

              • I think many are swayed in our onions because we know much of what she pretends to be is an out and out Lie. My objection to her is that she holds herself up to be a role model for others and does more damage than good. Thank goodness she didn’t do any charity work until the show. She was probably too busy sell faux designer bags and didn’t have the time.

              • I think Aviva touches a collective wound. She’s the judgmental narcissist, the Nellie Olsen of NY who belittles others with the trappings of manufactured status. There’s satisfaction in seeing her exposed. And ultimately…gone from view. There’s only so much we can take. And her father…just no. He is all kinds of wrong. No one gets like that with age. Not buying the innocent old man act.

              • yes it is! One of my favorite childhood shows was different strokes. My brother and I would belt out the theme song to it, Facts of Life, Family Ties and of course this lil gem.

              • Okay, seeing from Carole’s point of view, much of which came from Aviva’s mouth, I can see that. But to in one breath say it was wrong to kick out George and in the next preemptively kick out Ramona strikes me as hypocritical.

                Sorry, I am unconvinced, but enjoy but your arguments. I hope Carole redeems herself in the next episode. I really do want to like her again.

          • Carole finds no fault with the behavior of PT or George, but the other two are drunks, inelegant yada, yada, yada.

          • There is no defending George’s offensive behavior, but I think as mature adults we can discern the difference between offensive/ill-mannered and genuine threat. George is gross; but he doesn’t register as threatening to me. I’m slightly troubled that the tone of judgement on George seems to level him as dangerous. But I do understand why so many would want nothing to do with him. I just think Carole (and Heather and Luann too) handled the party situation well and did so with grace.

            And yes, you’re right a 16 year old and 40 year old behaving the same way would be more egregious to me. Age shouldn’t matter, and it doesn’t. I am however a bit more inclined to forgive an elderly person his or her less-than-pleasant behavior, because well, I’m a bit more patient with the mature segment of our population. But you’re right on your overall assessment of George.

            Sonja, at her core is actually quite the embodiment of sympathy. She exemplified this when Kelly was losing her mind on Scary Island, being the first to ask for everyone to stop aggravating Kelly even more. And she handled herself with aplomb with the grabby George in Miami. I wish we will see this side of Sonja more moving forward. I like my Sonja, slightly head in the clouds, but feet firmly grounded.

            It is bizarre to me that we condemn Carole for seemingly taking Aviva’s side. I don’t really see her choosing a side. In the clips above we see Carole saying she was shocked that Aviva felt she did not owe Ramona and Sonja an apology. But if that’s her condemnation, that’s pretty weak as well. So what? Carole’s sticking by her friend. Is that some sort of awful character trait? At most it’s annoying. It doesn’t make her some hypocritical a–hole though. I do agree that Heather is better at articulating out loud that Aviva was in the wrong.

            • Lol! Ray youre something else, are you in the midst of preparing the first encyclopedia,analysis edition of rhony?

            • Carole is a smart woman and was acutely aware of why George was at the fundraiser. She was gracious to walk George out after she saw him act a fool and knew he needed to go. He arrived suggesting then began to harass an apology out of Ramona. He was determined. He was out of place. Sonja made the best point when she told George he wasn’t there and reminded him that he knows his daughter.

        • The way I see it, George was an abomination in his younger years too. Telling his daughter to scream when he should have been calming her. Not normal behavior. Helpful in the lawsuit no doubt but not for PT’s psychological well being and now we see how this bullcrap manifests itself in her older days. Stamping her feet and DEMANDING to have her fears placated and acknowledged relentlessly. banners and red carpet and all that jazz.
          Plenty of horny old goats would never make sexually suggestive comments to their own flesh and blood. Something is very very off with him and age dont have a daggum thing to do with it. He has prolly always had boundary issues(churching it up) concerning his daughter. Maybe this disturbing behavior has been going on for a long time. Might be the reason her momma drank herself to death instead of protecting her daughter from him like normal mothers would?

  15. Omg – this woman is writing a book!? You just know that a room full of editors at Simon & Shuster have been dispatched to edit her absurd rumblings.

  16. I like Carole. I think her obversations in the interviews were her being the person she most likely did not feel comfortable being as a new member of that cast. You don’t go into a show as a new character and start being snarky–especially with that cast sof characters. She prefers being an observer of all the chaos rather being the one creating it. I have to agree that she seemed to side wrongly with George at Ramona’s event which I did not understand. George is as obnoxious as they come and yet his obnoxious behavior is somehow preferable to Ramona’s and Sonja’s (at least in the eyes of both Aviva and Carole). I still find Carole very likeable and have enjoyed her this season on the show.

    • Still remain in the honeymoon phase with Carole! Really enjoy her writing, perspective, and all that comes with it. So far I’m good with what she has brought to the table. Maybe it is because I find so many of the others painful to watch! Especially the Ramoamster, SonJa, and LouAnner.

  17. I seem to remember, that way back in the day, LuAnnie also had a major hissy fit meltdown, because Ramona told her pet designer not to lend the Countless any clothes….anyone else remember that? At any rate, I thoroughly enjoyed Dahling’s high indigeration at the temerity of anyone NOT wanting to lend clothes to her titled arse. How very dare they! (Don’t they know she’s the divorced 4th wife of a French Count?) I especially enjoyed the way LuAnn expected kudos for NOT mentioning that she’s a countess in every other sentence. So for that alone, for popping Countess LuAnn’s pomposity, I’m glad they added Carole.

    • No, I think she’s hilarious. Love her. And she had a cold sore last night and I felt terrible.

  18. I believe if you throw any one of us in with this group of women you would be hard pressed to know what to say when and how to act where. This group is over the top innappropriate..it would be overwhelming. I like Carole and could imagine myself holding back, biting my tongue in many of these instances. In the head shots remember that she has some bravo producer asking her questions and pulling answers from her she most likely wouldn’t ordinarily say. Caroles top lip….step awayyyy from the fillers….and please tell me it isn’t a permanent implant ala Traylor fish lips…..wassername? I believe in botox between the brows, but many of these HW have taken into Scaryville.

  19. The meanest thing Carole did (IMO, duh) was call Lu “pumpkinhead.” Telling someone they have a big head-not figuaritively-and pretending it’s a term of endearment is crappy. Lu overlooked it because she wanted to get along. In a way, Carole did Lu a favor-making a big deal over a dress, the Native American bit and general snark-because it gave her a story line. Without Carole’s digs the only things Lu had going were the pirate, getting pregnant.

  20. So impressive! Reading the comments on stoopidhousewives is far more entertaining than anything the RHousewives could write or say on the shows themselves. Insightful and funny.

    I’m an ex-pat New Yorker and for me, Heather (my favorite) and Carole come closest to being authentic Manhattanites. Sonja, Ramona, Aviva and LuAnn are undoubtedly from Long Island – or should claim to be — where people hang carnival-sized chandeliers in their low-ceilinged ranch houses. Posers and nouveau riche to the nth degree. In Manhattan, you can’t help but develop razor-sharp powers of observation about people and life and, with therapy being the Number One Industry there, you gain a lot of insight into personal and business relationships.

    But I digress. I, too, was a huge fan of Carole at the beginning. Now the affection is fading. She really is a portrait in contradiction and she really is snarky behind her castmates’ backs.

    And how anyone could side with George, a garden-variety pervert, is beyond me. I remember well, in my 20s, when I encountered many Georges on dark subway platforms in NYC looking to hustle me and other young women. Brrr. Chilling memories. All the more ironic that Aviva, permanently neurotic, uses the term “white trash.”

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